wow, this was really boring.  Get to the good stuff, like tell us what the grocery store is like and how the real people act, not the people they planted in your hotel to accomodate your every move!

I would love to fast-forward to perhaps two years from now, when we may with great hope look back at this performance to say "now THAT was a turning point" in our cultural global-ness. Though this one opportunity would in and of itself not be earth-shattering, it is indeed inportant beyond having "America's Orchestra" playing in North Korea.
It is the North Korea government's apparent desire reach out with the love of music that is important here. This one occurance is a cultural beginning that cannot be underestimated. It and of itself will not cause our countries to embrace and weep in each other's arms like prodigal sons, but the more enlightened will see it perhaps as a first step of one thousand miles.
Bravi! to the Maestro and collegues!

Richard Walters, Captain, United States Navy *Retired*

These are the same dictators and autocrats that we should have unconditional "dialogues" with. I'm sure once the open and fair minded leaders of North Korea meet Obama that they will turn over a new leaf and begin treating their people more humanely and open up the country.

My guess would be that they are not allowed to interact with ordinary North Koreans and that everyone they do meet is "planted" there by the North Korean government.  Closed societies like North Korea are not fond of outsiders seeing things that might "embarass" them even though the outside world already knows about those things.

Being very familiar with North Korea anti-american propaganda in the past and their ideology, I think that this event is either a effort to "open up" the country OR more likely a misleading ploy to appear more open! Be careful!

bet ian can't wait to get back to states so he doesn't have to worry about eyes watching him take a dunk,.  

I agree this is boring... but then again it does state he is CURRENTLY in North Korea. Maybe it had to be screened by censors. I'm interested in reading a follow up story when the experience is complete.

You assume that these people are allowed near any real people. The dear leader has complete control over everything. Hollywood could take stage direction lessons from this guy. Pyongyang is a city built for visual reference only.

Interesting. I would like to read more about everyday life there. What can the locals access on their intranet; what goods do the stores have, and what is the school system like? Since normal cell phones are illegal, can regular people buy the local ones' or just special folks?

There's no such thing as a grocery store, per se, in North Korea.  Tourists are tightly controlled - it's not like a trip to Europe where you can freely leave your hotel and walk around.  

If you try to do so you will either be followed anyway or just not get very far without being intercepted by a government minder.  They control every second of a tourist's time as much as possible.

The Great Teacher of Journalists, that's great! I'll give you five euros for it. Take away journalist's privilege and we're not far off ourselves.

I agree with the boring comment... come on  you didn't really think that piece was interesting did you?

ian - don't forget that you are on pyong-yang's turf, and not manhattan's or washington d.c.'s, and what i mean is, sarcasm, however subtle or unintentional, is not embraced in north korea. Even the hint of disrespect is quickly noted in a country where those who are left behind must explain the actions of their guests... treat everyone with respect, and the books and customs and elevators that surround you, and you will be invited back to cover another day...  g.m.

I visited North Korea in May of last year (2007) to see the National Arirang Games. I also stayed at the Yanggakdo hotel. It was designated for tourists, and most floors were deserted. We were not permitted to leave this hotel without permission. I found it utterly impossible to go anywhere without a guide being present. At no time could I speak with the "real people", since I did not speak Korean and it seemed locals were not permitted contact with foreigners. I got the occasional eye-contact, which was usually friendly. But other than that, the only contact or information I had was with my ever-present guide or through official newspapers or television. A little disappointing, but a fascinating few days nonetheless.

So basically this article was to tell us... well what was it supposed to tell us?  It started with something about a flag and ended with you trying to be witty.  Is this what journalism is to you Ian?  

This should not be viewed as an attempt to "reach out" to the west by North Korea. It is being done merely to curry favor and generate a warm fuzzy feeling toward the North to increase aid and some commercial activities. Any true cultural exchanges would be fatal to the North Korean regime. They simply could not exist in the face of the truth.

The one redeeming feature was to learn that the New York Philharmonic had the will and the guts to put up a bigger stars and stripes.  Refreshing, among all the stories of liberal appeasement and toadying to grubby little dictators

". . . something about a flag" shows a sad ignorance of history.  This is a game the North Koreans have been playing at Panmunjom for decades now--very interesting to anyone who has lived near there for some years.

They will NEVER open up their country.  Then they would lose control over the people.  However, yes, this was a historic event.  Amazing how music has that affect.
Remember, they still think they are at war with America.  The leaders have not told the masses that the war is over.  This is one of the most oppressed countries in the world.  And now a nuclear power - yikes!  (Didn't anyone see Lisa Ling's story of her trip there?)  YIKES! DOUBLE YIKES!!  (I had to take tranquilizers to watch it LOL - j/k)

KOREA, LIBYA, SYRIA, IRAQ, IRAN, CHINA, SOVIET UNION, AFGHANASTAN, ALBANIA, CUBA, VENEZUELA, MYANMAR, VIETNAM, CAMBODIA, LAOS, ANGOLA, SOMALIA,GERMANY, FRANCE, ENGLAND,ITALY,JAPAN, these former and current enemies, some countries cosolidated,divided, consolidated again, and some broke up forever. Our greatest enemies are now our greatest allies. Some friends and allies are now our foes and vice versa. On this list is a handfull of current foes. Send the leaders of all the foes into the ring (boxing, wrestling, or ufc) With the victory , comes the spoils. If this seems too simplistic, refer to history. Otherwise, who cares? What part of North Korea do we want?, their tropical beaches and sunshine?, or their fertile farmland? War is obsolete! Nuclear exchange prohibits capture of foreign soil, plus the strike team's country may also enjoy its ambience.
Do not all people need food, water, shelter, and clothing? Do they not all want a little enjoyment out of their voyage on earth? Perhaps a better road for their children?
So, the answer is real basic(as seen in Eastern Europe). You deserve the leadership you elect or allow to take charge, or throw them out one way or another!!!

This will have been a memorable experience for those whom travel and played in North Korea

Reporting from North Korea is restricted, censored, and impolite observations are not allowed.
Duh, he is being guided by designated government guides. Hellooo! What did you think he was going to be able to report to us? Are you readers clueless? Did you think that perhaps what he was able to report to us while still in North Korea was going to be anything less than watered down?!

I saw the Star Spangled Banner performance on the local NBC news and was impressed.

Western Journalists amaze me. They salivate to criticize and find fault with almost anything conservative in America. But let one of these same reporters visit those who are without a doubt the most repressed and brutalized people in the world, and the reporter is apparently utterly bind to their plight, or lacks the courage to report the truth. I'm surprise the reporter didn't detail what he had for dinner. Classy reporting!

interesting article, but i wonder how THE BOOKKEEPER who sold you the book fared after Pyongyang officials saw this writeup? I think you gave away her location -- i wonder how she is.

Boooorrrringg!!
Couldn't you have at least tried to talk about something of importance, like say, reuniting North and South Korea?

Not open, no way.  I was stationed in Korea numerous times off and on for 8 years. I led tours of Panmunjom at the DMZ and was last stationed there in 1999. Make no mistake; this is just another political ploy to get more food, rice etc. The new South Korean President was just elected and he is a conservative who already said he was not going to do what the previous democratic president did and that was send tons of rice almost unconditional. North Korea is in a constant famine, and always needs food.  However, it uses that rice to feed its huge military which Kim Jung IL has in place to keep everyone in check. China is also distancing itself from North Korea because it wants economic ties with the United States and since China was North Korea's chief ally they pretty much have to open to us in order to get South Korea and China to send rice because if North Korea makes us upset then maybe China and South Korea play hardball as well.
In order to straighten them out China, the US and South Korea should play straight up hardball and not send anything, and as cruel as that sounds the current way of doing business since the cease fire 50 years ago has resolved absolutely zero. The whole reason for North Korea building nukes is not for protection but for black mail to get more rice. It is a constant game we play where they threaten to build nukes and we capitulate by giving them more rice.
North Korea has concentration camps like Germany had in WWII, this is why all of them say they love the so called "Dear Leader" otherwise they die or go to the camps along with their complete families. Make no mistake, Kim Jung IL will stay in power and hold his people under his thumb so long as we continue to play the same game with them we have played for the past 50 years.
I was a squad leader, Platoon Sergeant and Company First Sergeant with the 2nd Infantry division at Camp Hovey South Korea and ran numerous patrols along the DMZ...I know what I am talking about. Watch, sometime within the next 2-3 months North Korea will be right back at it with their threats and this NY Philharmonic trip will have meant nothing.  2-3 months after that they will want to talk again and will make amends and have another open door policy.
The reality is, Washington does not want to deal with them and would prefer to just keep them happy and contained. By the way, North Korea has approximately 10,000 artillery pieces deployed along the DMZ which is 35 miles from the capital of Seoul South Korea. Seoul is so densely populated that if the North elected to fire those artillery pieces in an all out attack it is estimated that 1,000,000 South Koreans would die within the first 24 hrs just from artillery alone.  
Unlike the first gulf war where we were able to detect Saddam's forces heading towards Kuwait, the North Korean forces are already forward deployed where they would start the battle so there could be very little warning if they decided to attack.
Hands down North Korea is a very touchy political situation but to continue to deal with the North like we have for the past 50 years with almost zero progress is ridiculous.  Think of it this way, If Cube had the amount of artillery pieces, missiles etc pointed towards the US and could kill 1,000,000 people what would we do? We already know that answer by the bullet we dodged from Oct 1962, yet South Korea which is one of our chief allies and well on their way to becoming the next Japan from an economic standpoint, please see LG, Samsung, Hyundai as examples and we let the North threaten them with a gun to their head and ours.  This is a tight spot because if you cut off the rice they will have no choice but to attack, however, if you give the rice and not get any serious consolations back our way then all it proves is that a 3rd world dictator can govern US, China and South Korean policy.

I was in S. Korea in the 90's when a N. Korean submarine ran aground on the east coast. The commandos killed the sub crew and worked their way back to N. Korea. To my recollection, only one of them was ever caught alive. He hid in a farmer's barn and the farmer called the police. The commando was in shock that a mere farmer would have a telephone. Heck, in the south, almmost everyone has a house phone and/or a cell phone.

I took a trip to the USSR in the late 70's.  It was much the same.  Minders, buildings that were for show (but didn't work), no cars.  If you talked to a person, that person was interrogated for hours.

I wonder how, with what is happening in Cuba, what with how the change of leadership is going, if Jr. is starting to consider what would happen if he were in Fidel's shoes, if he were sick and did not have the strength to preside over mass events and etc.  Who would take his place, and would they be as peaceful about it as Raoul?  And R.'s pretty well up there too.

Yes that was very empty.. we knew all that.. must ba an agent to be that boring..

Well, having lived and visited in post-communist countries (on many occasions), it is good to see a Journalist who potentially sold out a source ane noone in this column commented on it.  The book clerks giving a book in the manner he presents, puts that book clerks health and safety (perhaps life) in danger.  He should watch what he writes, he can get someone killed.  If I were a North Korean Politzi I know who I would be questioning right now.  The Book Clerk.  This is a Stupid Journalist -- who does not understand the communism or post communist states.

I doubt that the smaller flag was intentional. Let's be magnanimous, and let's give the North-Koreans the benefit of the doubt! If they thought that America, like dollar which "they no longer take," is these days "smaller," I am sorry to say it, they guessed right!

I hope McCain gets in, and then turns the place into a glass parking lot. No more suffering, no more dictators in platform shoes building nukes while the population starves.Ahh, who are we kidding, next time they launch a missle over japan will we cough up billions more in aid.  

I want to preface my comments by saying I am pretty conservative socially and politically. I love America and think we have a great people. I also think our politicians for decades have been arrogant in dealing with other countries. Specifically we tell them how to be. Threatening them in many case with numerous punishments if they don't toe the line. We are no longer the only super power. The world has caught up. It would appear the only way we are going to continue to operate in the world is to convince other countries that what we do works. It will not suffice to bully those countries any more. It would appear that a reasonable choice would be to lead by example. Go to Pyonyang and show out stuff. For better or worse. Go to China at the Olympics and show our stuff. By that I mean do a good job, stop bragging and shut up. Lead by example as it were. Try traveling a bit. We continue to be thought badly of by much of the rest of the world. As the world changes do we not think we will pay a price for our political arrogance? Do you like being told what to do? Probably not. Lets take of advantage of the invitations we get from the rest of the world and when there, behave. That demonstrates strength and confidence.

I want to preface my comments by saying I am pretty conservative socially and politically. I love America and think we have a great people. I also think our politicians for decades have been arrogant in dealing with other countries. Specifically we tell them how to be. Threatening them in many case with numerous punishments if they don't toe the line. We are no longer the only super power. The world has caught up. It would appear the only way we are going to continue to operate in the world is to convince other countries that what we do works. It will not suffice to bully those countries any more. It would appear that a reasonable choice would be to lead by example. Go to Pyonyang and show out stuff. For better or worse. Go to China at the Olympics and show our stuff. By that I mean do a good job, stop bragging and shut up. Lead by example as it were. Try traveling a bit. We continue to be thought badly of by much of the rest of the world. As the world changes do we not think we will pay a price for our political arrogance? Do you like being told what to do? Probably not. Lets take of advantage of the invitations we get from the rest of the world and when there, behave. That demonstrates strength and confidence.

Ahhh, Socialism. The bad idea that just won't die. Too bad the people of North Korea don't know it yet. I hope someday they will. I was a 16 year old kid in West Germany when the monolith that was the Soviet Union collapsed. To see the surprise and happiness of a people freed is awe inspiring. We, as free people need not forget that it didn't collapse on it's own. It took leaders with guts, determination, and hellish patience 73 years to effect this great event. Today, the DPRK is in it's 62nd year of oppressive existence and hopefully, the end is not far off. But I can guarantee you, (yes, guarantee) that this will not come to be, under a national liberal ideology such as is espoused by today's Democratic Party. Hell, they're socialists themselves!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

my guess is that robert from new york is smoking something thinking hussein obama can change north korea. obama can't even make a vote in the senate half the time on our own policies, how is he going to get north korea to change theirs?

How come nobody mentions about the Japanese Italian lady who donated money so that this trip was possible ?

Contrary to what "Shaun" says, I doubt McCain would do anything. He is a big business candidate. He doesn't care what happens to N. Korea, just as long as they aren't building nukes. And besides, since when is it the   job of the U.S to turn every other country into a democracy? The Koreans need to make those changes for themselves.

To Stacey Edwards:  I'm curious, just how are the Korean people supposed to "make those changes (ie, change to a Democracy) for themselves."??

I find some of the comments by Ian Wiliams to be similar to my experience when I traveled to North Korea.  Most especially the elevator experience in the hotel.  I was part of a large contingent of Taekwon-Do athletes that traveled there for the 13th World Festival of Youth and Students in 1989. The experience was memorable although I am not sure at this point I would care to return. Back in 1989 the USA/DPRK relations were more strained than they are today. Being an American in N. Korea at that time was most uncomfortable.  We were not able to move about by ourselves but were required to have an 'interpreter' with us at all times. We saw only what they wanted us to see and when they wanted us to see it.  They put the Americans on their own bus while they bussed other countries together.  They watched us continuosly day and night. If we had forgotten a piece of clothing at a function, someone would show up with it at our hotel room the next morning. Interesting that they knew who it belonged to. During competition the Americans were jeered at during their performances. We were the only ones who could not contact our families via telephone as others were able to. Film from pictures we took mysteriously disappeared. One evening we were escorted down to 'International Street' for lots of good food and felt compelled to burst out in song as it was the 4th July back in the states.....we sang the Star Spangled Banner as loud as we could!  We video taped it but unfortunately it came up missing as we were leaving the country for home. There were more interesting things that happened. Lots of propaganda! Still have it as they handed it out as we departed. Interesting information. But as I said previously, I would not trade the experience but not sure I would return. It was somewhat unnerving.

I glad to see some of you have an idea of the reality of "life" in No. Korea. It's been an interest of mine since watching a documentary while traveling in Vietnam a few years ago.  That said, I think the NY Philharmonic should have turned down this trip.

The only thing that can come out of this is to give Kim Jong Il a sense of legitimacy that he does not deserve.  PyongYang isn't even a real city; loyal party members only. The rest of the country lives in a brainwashed surreal terror zone that we can't even imagine.  "The Aquariums of Pyongyang" is a good place to start if you want to read about the reality of No. Korea.

You normally could not said much while you were there. Even their cell phones were confiscated and issued with a local cell phone in order to monitor their movement. It would not suprised me that the cell phone has a GPS built-in. A full story is coming quickly as soon as they are landed in Bejing.  

Kevin J. Gaughan was a more interesting read than the article the journalst wrote. If he was a journalist I would be interested in reading everything he had to say. You, obviously, paid attention to where you were, and what was going on around you. Being there doesn't always make for an informed opinion, as you can tell from what that journalist had to say. How many times have you listened to someone who has 'traveled' go on and on about their trip and you just know that they missed the whole purpose of 'travel'. Their trip was about room service, and all the inconvienences they suffered, and how irritating it was that the people where they were shopping didn't speak English. They missed 'seeing' the people around them, the food, the culture, and the beauty of the country. They totally missed out on the zest for life, laughter, and down right enjoyment of 'place'. I've experienced travel 'native' style, slept in what my host refered to as a bedroom, but was in truth a birthing pen for sheep. I've been hosted by some of what I would call the most beautiful people in the world...  and they had nothing, materially, but shared all they had in their effort to make me comfortable. It was emotionally staggering to witness that kind of open  welcome and generosity. I had more fun with them, and shared more laughter than I ever had before, and since. It's the old joke the Europeans have, 'what do you call a person that only speaks one language?'...  an American! I love this country, and I appreciate the sacrifice our soldiers have made to keep us free. You only have to travel to recognise how many daily freedoms we take for granted. There's no place like home Toto. When we live in a world with internet access to information, about everything worldwide, we should take advantage. That journalist (Ian Williams)isn't our only resource to information.  

Joe, South Korea
to Jim, in Des Moines, Iowa
how did America do it Jim??

let us not forget that we are still officially at war with North Korea. I feel for the people there. What a shame to live under the control of a monster and live within the world's largest prison

To Jim from Iowa:  The answer to that question is simple...you just have to think back to our own early history...how did we,the U.S., become our own nation that is a democracy?  Our forefathers banded together and fought for it.

Good information. I am glad you were able to relay such information. I will look for this book. I happen to be into such books when I can get them.

I too would like to know how the Koreans are to change thier government themselves?!  After so long of being dehumaned and over controlled.  Those rare and strong people who are brave enough to even talk about taking action likely meet with bad fate...just for talking!
So, if you have a small community of brave people willing to risk thier lives just for talking how likely is it that they can suceed unless they have great masses behind them.  The organization it takes to overthrow a government such as this would have to be emmense in power and organization.  All the meantime under threat of death for just talking!  It will not work on it's own.  N. Koreans will need help if it is to oust thier Dear Leader.  I'm not suggesting it's the USA's sole job.  Frankly I think we stick our nose in too much for the most part and I agree we have political arrogance. But if we can work with China and South Korea we may help the tyranny end.  And no it's not our job to set up a democratic government and stick around for years to poke our noses everywhere.  But I do think action is necessary.

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